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Author Topic: Pritchett bullet  (Read 318 times)

maillemaker

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Pritchett bullet
« on: May 11, 2021, 08:41:48 AM »
Looking for 10 people interested in a historical replica of the Pritchett bullet, as shown, with whatever allowances are required to make it a castable bullet (for example, a meplat on the nose for the sprue).

Please only respond if you are interested in this particular bullet, with dimensions as shown.

This bullet is a copy of the original "Pritchett" style of bullet used in early Enfield ammunition for the P1853 Enfield Rifle Musket.  This version of the bullet was not intended to have any plug or iron cup in the base.  It also was the larger .568" diameter.

Thanks,
Steve



« Last Edit: May 12, 2021, 10:35:03 AM by maillemaker »

maillemaker

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2021, 10:03:15 AM »




The weight is supposed to be 530 grains, I am computing 553 grains.  I'm not sure where to remove material without violating either given dimensions or the given shape.

Steve
« Last Edit: May 11, 2021, 10:14:12 AM by maillemaker »

Mike B.

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2021, 11:43:48 PM »
maillemaker

Just so you know that the bullet that you show with the fully rounded nose is more likely to be finished off by rounding the flat cast bullet after it is cast and thus is not as cast...

I have done the same a goodly number of times with soft alloys such as pure lead for your endeavor after the casting is done...

As the mould as you have drawn it will be a hollow base you will most probably have to do a nose pour design... not a base pour...

You basically cannot have both so that you will if a mould is made have at least a flat at the nose where the sprue is poured on this hollow base bullet to start out with...

However that is a separate issue that is for working out down the line if you can get 9 more individuals to buy into your group buy query... with a rounded nose top punch and a .568 sizing die to support the cast bullet body when forming the final round nose...

My reply is to your concern that your software is predicting a much heavier bullet than the original design in history shows...

My software, which I believe NOE is also still using will unfortunately not allow me to do both a Beveled base and a Hollow base at the same time... so the attachment prediction  is as close as one can come with a fully rounded nose and your basic hollow base... to accurate predict the cast bullet weight...

My software will allow me to do a fully rounded nose, which will allow me to come very close to your original design dwg...

That being said and trying to keep all of your shown dimensions the same ...

My software predicts with pure lead that the attached bullet image will be about 544 grains.

Adding your complicated bevel base and the additional internal hollow base taper to the mix you should... I believe...  be very close to your 530 grain goal.

What your software calc is using as factors for predicting the final cast bullet weight that you have noted are... I cannot say...

It appears that your calculation is incorrect based on the software that I and I believe NOE is still utilizing for their group buy sketches...

Good luck in your endeavor...

I have no other purpose on this thread except to try to answer your query on the weight discrepancy that you have noted... and to possibly offer some way to resolve your sprue flat vs your original drawing showing a fully rounded nose...

Take Care , & Stay Safe
Mike B.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2021, 11:51:27 PM by Mike B. »

maillemaker

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2021, 09:20:06 AM »
Hello Mike,

Quote
Just so you know that the bullet that you show with the fully rounded nose is more likely to be finished off by rounding the flat cast bullet after it is cast and thus is not as cast...

Yes, the bullet will need to be nose cast, and thus there will be a sprue meplat on top.  This is why I said:

"...with whatever allowances are required to make it a castable bullet (for example, a meplat on the nose for the sprue)."

My rendition of the bullet as shown will have to be modified to be made into a nose-castable design that NOE can cut.

My software is Solid Edge.  It is mechanical design software, not bullet design software.  It simply takes the volume of the design, applies the density for lead, and computes a weight.  It should be accurate for the volume shown.



Steve


maillemaker

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2021, 09:53:54 AM »
I have played with the shape of the nose to pull the weight down to 532 grains while holding all the given dimensions.




Steve

Star of The West

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2021, 06:03:12 AM »
I believe the only way to cast a Pritchett like that, would be to have (what I believe it's called), a heel cast bullet. The majority of original Pritchett bullets were swaged, but some molds were sent by Great Britain to the south during the Civil War. You would have to cut the excess lead off of the side, leading to other potential issues.

http://www.buckstix.com/buckpics/umold3.jpg


Mike B.

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2021, 03:08:40 AM »
There are I believe two items... that should be noted at this point on the forum thread...

Item 1

It is my understanding that NOE uses the same bullet design software that I also have to design the moulds and also uses that same software to program its CNC machines...

So it may be that you can get 10 individuals to buy into your design only to find out that NOE cannot manufacture your particular design...

If the bullet design software program will not allow the design to be drawn up as you have designed it... Then the odds are that NOE will end up saying that it cannot produce the mould as designed as Al has done in the past on similar civil war designs such as this...

Normally Al most probably would have replied by now on this forum thread as to the feasibility of NOE manufacturing your complicated HB mould pins, vs what NOE is offering in the HP - HB pin design category.

As Al has recently replied on the forum that he is basically too busy in production producing backlogged product, to attend to monitoring the forum threads... it is your call on that particular beveled base HB pin design... on how you want to proceed in this endeavor...

A potential alternate method is to review your design to have your curved Hollow base pin designed and manufactured as a separate entity more in line with the single cavity Lyman style HB pins as are on single cavity shotgun slug moulds... with the die body drilled through to allow a more traditional style of HB mould pin to be utilized... or look at the current NOE mould offerings as a potential alternate guidance to your HB pin design...

Item 2

If I was doing the design on this mould. I might have started by slightly reducing your calculated cast bullet weight by adding the sprue flat to the nose design which will eventually have to be added anyway... on a nose pour design... Possibly a .180 flat might potentially be an option to consider...

If you get 10 individuals that are interested then have to change the mould to be able to produce the basic mould shape... with a round nose and then change said mould to have an undetermined size sprue flat... what does that do to the final cast bullet weight, & say to those 10 individuals who were looking at the rounded nose configuration?

I would then change the HB plug dimensions towards a more traditional NOE HB pin design an tweak the HB weight dimensions to get the cast bullet weight that you want...  To potentially duplicate the ballistics, & so that the HB pin with its rounded dimensions might not be quite as time consuming to manufacture... in a more than a single cavity design format...

That way once you get a design that NOE can potentially more easily manufacture you may have a better chance in getting what your heart most desires...

Your Call Again... on how you wish to proceed...

Ok I had my say... on how I would approach this mould design ... & its produce-ability...

I sincerely wish you luck in your endeavor... I sincerely hope that my replies will be seen by you and the others that might read this forum thread as being constructive to you, & to others that might be interested in your mould design... & potentially getting it produced...

Take Care, & Stay Safe...
Mike B.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2021, 03:17:05 AM by Mike B. »

maillemaker

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2021, 09:00:03 PM »
Third time's a charm  :D

Quote
Looking for 10 people interested in a historical replica of the Pritchett bullet, as shown, with whatever allowances are required to make it a castable bullet (for example, a meplat on the nose for the sprue).

Steve

Mike B.

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Re: Pritchett bullet
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2021, 07:03:15 AM »
Ok ... Good luck on your fishing expedition...
I'll leave you to man the pole to feel for nibbles...

 



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