- This topic is empty.
-
Topic
-
k7sparky
Been using cast in wheel guns and pistols for many years, most from commercial sources and a small percentage of my own when I had the extra time.
A 223 Rem is my first adventure with cast in center fire rifles so could use a bit of advice.
Have the PB mould and Patmarlins PB checkmaker. Feel like tweezers would help. Pop can punchings.
Casting WW and water quenching. LASC Cast Bullet notes quotes 18 BHN. The tests I run are 21 to 22. Same source “The Myth of Arsenic” by Wiljen gets 21 with tap water (66F) and 25 with antifreeze cooled with dry ice (19F) so I am in the correct ball park. They are 64 grain per the drawing.
First blush is 21g AA2460 Lyman says 20.5 WW 748 for Contender. For those that weren’t around back when AA was a data powder and we ordered it direct from McEwen, TN, the data was WW 748.
Test platform is a 700 varminter in 223 Rem – twist 1:12. Shoots better with jackets than I could back when I still had young eyes.
Tried 2 without the Aluminum checks and got the gray cloud about 10 feet from the muzzle and pristine target as predicted for non checked over 1500 to 2000 fps.
With the checks not a bragging group, but a nice place to start.
Too rainy to drag out the Oehler for now.
Lyman manual for 225462 says OAL 2.090 That OAL is between the front 2 grooves. I’m using a LEE factory crimp so no groove is a non issue.
The first try was crimping in the top groove for OAL 1.994 in max length cases. That decreases case volume and will jack pressure.
Functioning is not an issue with the bolt action.
The 700 likes most condoms about 40 mills from touching the lands.
Is there an argument with cast in center fire rifle to prefer using a groove enforced OAL or specified cartridge as choice? With jackets OAL is choice so would guess using the groove in my initial test was a mistake.
k7sparky-
Replies
-
Still floundering around figuring out how to get these little guys to look perfect. :-[
LEE Pro 4 – 20 about 1/2 full and this batch was cast with the mould hard against the spout for a 2 count and a 5 count between cavities. Got perfect bases and grooves, but still minor surface flaws. Only the second time trying to cast this small a pill. Tried to keep the pot 775F. Either need to build a PID temp controller or upgrade the pot. :
Keeping the mould around 400F is also fun.Patmarlins PB checkmaker and Bud cans for the checks.
Today set OAL to the Lyman book 2.090″ Measuring length where the Ogive touches the lands, I expect an OAL of 2.12″ would be close to this 700’s sweet spot. The 100 yard today looks better than the 50 yard yesterday with OAL at 1.994.
Same charge of 21g AA2460. May need a boost?
Got out the Oehler 35P and 5 shot average was 2592 fps. 8 foot off the muzzle. First shot was 2622 and rest fell off a bit and is what I would guess for getting the moly worked in a bit.
Should have used the Foul Out to get the jacket fouling out before starting this adventure. Now I assume there is a bit of lead on top of the gilding metal even though I can’t see any after a quick cleaning. Guess the next thing to do is use the Foul Out with both solutions.
Using Fryxell’s take on NRA lube with Moly Lube from Wally World.
Top is 100 yd bottom is 50 yd
Nothing to brag about. Still don’t feel too bad for my first adventure in casting for a center fire rifle. Getting better at casting these and pickier about weeding out the culls would also help a lot. Still minute of venison
PatMarlin
Great thread Sparky…!
I’m glued with all eyes and total interest in your findings and progress. I’ve been wanting to start working on 22 cal with a few rifles that I have not had a chance to shoot, and of course PB’s. One is an old wildcat cartridge in 22 Lovell.
I have at least one of Al’s 22 cal molds, but no PB. I think I’m going to machine out a cavity and remove the gas check shank to get going.
I would say definitely use the foul out to get rid of any trace of copper before shooting lead and I always set OAL into the lands. Always have. I think any bullet jump is not great for cast shooting, but of course I don’t know everything and there’s always exceptions to every rule.
Your tests look very promising and headed in the write direction for sure!
Pat
The only Lyman manual I have that has this mould is old Revolver & Pistol manual 2nd ed
It list the OAL for a Contender as 2.090My 2 latest editions don’t seem to have it listed.
In my Remington 700 the nose hits the lands at 2.070″ I measured wrong the first time.
Anyone have an older Lyman manual that lists this one for rifle? What is the OAL and charge for WW748?
The first groups after using the Foul Out looked promising. Foul out results > no gilding metal and about 30 seconds of lead > clean.
richardhemmerde
k7sparky,
I know it’s been a while since you last posted but I just saw the threat. I was wondering if you continued your experiments and how they went.
I load cast for .308, .300 BLK and 45/70 and want to give 223 Rem a shot. I have the same rifle you mentioned so your experience is particularly valuable to me.
Richard
Full.Lead.Taco
Continued for a bit and need to get back to it again.
Got around to getting a PID controller and building a 4-20ma input output 0 to 120VAC interface for the pot so it now holds temp within a few degrees. Also got Al’s temp meter and probe to keep check on mould temp. First run with that setup was 2 different weights of 50 Cal for BP season and almost everything dropped from the 4 holler was +/- 1g. Constant temp DOES make a difference as well as Al’s close tolerance manufacturing.
Cornmastah echoes my experience with Patmarlins PD checks for 22. They are tiny. I found getting more than 1 punching into the forming die was also a problem to watch out for. Just more to learn. Not a complaint. Pushing up the speed would not even possible without the PB checks.
Next up will be running more water quenched WW holding the temperatures more constant. Not only more constant weight but better fill out.
I looked around for more targets with notes and couldn’t find them.
What I remember is somewhere between 2900 & 3000 fps I started getting gray puffs again. Not sure if I was getting them because of my poor QC on GC, cast or just a RPM limit with this design.
PatMarlin
richardhemmerde- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.