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sgt.mike
Loaded some of these for a test tomorrow (Sunday) in Bjornb’s Winchester 1917 Service rifle.
Initial loads will be using SR4759 at 20 grs and another batch (20 rounds of each batch) using 21 grs of the same powder.
As was noted in another post here I annotated several items that required some attention. Having corrected most of the rifles issue I will see if she will respond with 1.5″ moa or less.The following target is the baseline to improve upon:
Depending upon what tomorrow shows I “might” move to the NOE 311331 218gr powder choices are on different ends of the spectrum IMR 4227 and IMR 4350 or slower
sgt.mike
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Well gentlemen,
The results was not what I was hoping for but valuable lessons with the rifle was learned today.
The bedding (in-letting) still needs to be improve. Loaded several of the 168gr hornady Match with 47 gr of IMR 4064 COAL at 3.350″ after spraying shotgun patterns I shimmed (.020″ paper giving 9 Lbs of pressure) between the front pressure point of the stock and the barrel I was rewarded with the following group
.878″ outside to outside was not bad considering how she was performing earlier. A Three shot group which is nowhere near giving real good clear results as to how she will shoot. But without wasting any further ammo because she is not bedded correctly and the groups was so terrible at 100 yards I shifted back to the 50 yard line to work on the barrel pressure point. While attempting to figure out what the rifle was attempting to tell me so bear in mind all groups that I am showing are at 50 yds.
I then loaded the NOE 310-165 FN with 20 grs of SR 4759 with a COAL of 3.158″
The next loads was again the NOE 310-165 FN exactly the same but 21 grs vs 20 grs. but I want to show why a three shot groups does not tell the story here is the first three shots:
three dead in the same hole amazing right even at 50 yds but now “for the rest of the story” as somebody used to say
All in all not a bad day , positive results was had
now to git her to bed properly and ensure at least 9 lbs of upward pressure at the stock ferrule (aka pressure point).
This will be a ongoing saga in order to get some good results for a frienddarrinwright
I tried most every form of denial imaginable for decades, literally, and FINALLY went to 10 – shot groups. Fliers are trying to tell the shooter something, and in my humble opinion, a serious shooter is a fool not to give the fliers more thought and analysis than the rest of the group. Just my Dollar bill minus 98 pennies.
tommeboy
frankelliott
Mike,
18.5 and 19.0 gr of 4759 are also good loads. If you haven’t tried pistol primers, they have always worked best for me with 4759, Rem 2 1/2 1st and F150 next. Wolf pistol might also work well.This is the winning info for the National CBA Scope champion.
Haufschild, Bob,
Rem 03A3,
Leupold 6X,
Lyman 311299 207 gr,
Lyman #2 alloy, 3025 nose – .312 base,
Lube LBT Blue,
19.0 gr SR4759, 1500 chrono
He shot a 783/800 combined 100 and 200 yards
Frank
Mike,
18.5 and 19.0 gr of 4759 are also good loads. If you haven’t tried pistol primers, they have always worked best for me with 4759, Rem 2 1/2 1st and F150 next. Wolf pistol might also work well.Frank
Thanks Frank when I get her stock work done I’ll try them most of the 1903 and other milsurps like the 20 -21 grs which is why I went there first.
Thanks for the advice
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/ Mikebjornborud
Iron sights? I can’t shoot them anymore. Diabetes has made me that I have to use a scope. Even then they are not the greatest.
This rifle and the 303 Enfield #4 were always ones I liked.
What has to be done to the bedding on these rifles to make them shoot good?
Tomme Boy,
when originally issued the 1917 and the 1903 Springfield has a upward pressure at the front band that is usually 4 lbs.
Per TM 9-1270 “The float in the barrel may be checked by placing thumb on under side of barrel and forefinger on top of upper band and exerting pressure on the barrel The barrel should spring away from stock when a pressure of approximately 4 pounds is exerted”
With that said the NM 1903 range up as high as 15 lbs but usually in the 7-10 range is the preferred range to tighten them up.
How?? well first the rifle MUST be fired to check MOST are absolutely fine with the issue “Free Float” ( 4lbs as stated above in the TM) 2MOA is normal.
Another Source is LTC Brophy’s book “the 1903 Springfield”
When Bjornb and Goodsteel was over at my house I called them over and without the front or mid bands on the action rocked in the stock .. That is a sign to some LOL …. so I used the old GI (aka the Remington)method I placed a washer under the back tang screw behind the trigger it applied about 4 lbs. I then shot it and still shot poorly so then I placed shims (cardboard box materials from ammo) to find the pressure that she wanted. once I found out approx .020″ thickness (in the fore end band) she started shooting I then went to Goodsteel’s shop to measure the poundage of pressure.some references :
http://www.jouster.com/forums/showthread.php?12840-Major-Culver-s-USMC-Rebuilding-of-the-M1903-Springfield-monograph
Read the M1903A3 National match part here in Brophy’s book:
http://books.google.com/books?id=vb3dDN9FiekC&pg=PA205&lpg=PA205&dq=1903+springfield+fore+end+pressure+brophy&source=bl&ots=MbWkLvw3C-&sig=KbYVmrDV_aKHCiuCdcehP1WVDyg&hl=en&sa=X&ei=EQF8VNidDcepNrSjg-AC&ved=0CFUQ6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=1903%20springfield%20fore%20end%20pressure%20brophy&f=falsenow LTC Brophy calls 7 pounds some required a little bit more but 7 was the average. the 1903 and 1917 was built to pretty much the same standards within the stockwork.
When I get the chance I’ll take some photos that will help in showing how the stock work is corrected when the bedding is not correct.
One has to remember these rifle have been rebuilt numerous times to have one that is mismatched is actually truer to issue than one that some book says is “correct”.Bjornb Like I texted you she is dying to shoot and she will, she told me so.
I’ll attack the front stock ferrule under the recoil lug that should apply more pressure at the Front band’s pressure point. I might have to lengthen the rear tang stock Ferrule or I could just gently work the wood down and adjust the ferrules from there.
Just realized I do have photos of the ferrules her ya go:
Front (recoil area):
note the little bit of prussian blue on the stock just behind the recoil lug on the left that is all the contact with the stock. the metal ferrule is holding the bottom of the receiver from contacting the wood.Now the rear tang ferrule:
P.S.
ya know I never said what lube I used today ….. it was LARS45 white label 2500 of course what I have used with this bulletHere is what I am attempting to get wise first let me introduce my 1903A3:
the 310-165 FN
and here is what level I am going for this was shot 100 yards 5-shots 21 gr SR4759 white label lube 2500 with the above Springfield which outside the stock ( someone put her in a win 70 stock I’ll eventually put her back in Military dress) as issued even down to the redfield jr mount ( they was used on the 1903A4’s)
One has to remember the 1917 was used 1 year for the National matches it was ONLY the sight rear adjustments that caused so much ruckus that brought the Springfield back even though actually the scores was higher weird huh
😮Edited to add:
Here is the tang shims that was used by Remington during war time production usually with the 1903 A3’s
darrinwright
tommeboy
frankelliott
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