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sgt.mike
You see her across the room your heart stops in your throat her name Hivel Accuracy. She is not a stranger she has been in your neighborhood you have seen her numerous time with and without makeup she is always stunning, the envy of everyone. You could date the girl Miss Evey Mediocre next door she is fine girl, but Miss Hivel Accuracy has captured your imagination and desire. If Miss Hivel Accuracy was a “plain Jane” she would not be so desirable. So you vow to win her over to you, but she is demanding in her adornments, wants, and a demanding dance partner. So you must step your game up.
Because I am still attempting to shoot high Velocity cast even though I have not posted any results yet. Why you asked read above and just think for a moment anyone cast and shoot mediocre loads not everyone can push the envelope to the outer edge. I have been doing the prep that I feel will assist in such a endeavor I have been stepping up the casting that I have been observing Larry Gibson and Bjornb in their endeavors. I borrowed from Goodsteel his 310 165 XCB Mold and some Lino in order to shoot high vel High RPM bullets with acceptable accuracy. So off I go singing “ My girls a pretty girl, shes a Virginia girl, I buy her anything to keep her in style”
So lets delve off in to the details of the casting process to this endeavor as Larry and Bjornb allude to in their post. But most readers just I think are not paying attention to the details or simply overlooking them. Seems that in order to win Miss Hivel over she demands perfect bullets and components, I base this not on my experience but those of Larry Gibson and Bjornb. As such I casted a total thus far of 574 bullets of that I performed a visual inspection, any defect of casting flow, rounded lube grooves, rounded bases, high or low sprue cuts (247 rejected). The 327 remaining was weight sorted that the only deviation was +.1gr to the listed weight.
Here is a results of a two day casting sessions with the XCB bullet (been doing the NOE 311331 as well just have not documented it as I plan on shooting both). Because Lino contains antimony of a higher degree than that of wheel weight 50/50 or Lyman #2 the weights will be off a bit and the bullets will not shrink the degree of those two alloys. But I digress and ramble on, lets move forward shall we.
155.0gr (+.1gr deviation) (2)
155.8gr (+.1gr deviation) (1)
156.0gr (+.1gr deviation) (30)
156.2gr (+.1gr deviation) (62)
156.4gr (+.1gr deviation) (146)
156.6gr (+.1gr deviation) (74)
156.8gr (+.1gr deviation) (10)
157.0gr (+.1gr deviation) (2)
While this was done in Lino I cannot see where it would not be done regardless of alloy in order to take Miss Hivel Accuracy to the prom or even a short dance.
Talking to Larry Gibson one night this week I was discussing the size differences and how to size them down without having the them offset and size unevenly . Larry stated to me to apply some sort of lube into the lube grooves if I was to size down to prevent smearing the lube grooves. Worked great
I handed some of these to Goodsteel today he could not at first see where the bullet had been sized until I pointed it out.
I am in hopes that Bjornb, Goodsteel, and Larry Gibson will invoke their 2 cents here as well as other in how to cast the best possible bullet in order to date Miss Accuracy.
Stand by for further feedback if I am proven wrong with my methods these are a thought and a ways, and means to the objective. Some will view this going yes and what else is new but you must realize that I am gearing this to the new or younger (not in age but time) caster, and as such invite your methods that work. as Temp of the alloy and molds temp is critical items that I have not covered as well as the cleaning of the molds, the alloy, use of items /methods that aids in consistency.
sgt.mike
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Replies
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timmalcolm
They’re all wrong! Melt them down and start again.
You are not casting HV worthy bullets till they all drop within .1 grains of each other for a 2000 bullet casting session. Only then will you be truly casting worthy projectiles, and of those 2000, you are only allowed 5 rejects (because sometimes the bullets hit eachother as they fall on the velvet gold trimmed pillow) LOL!They look great Mike. I really don’t have a thing to say because what you are demonstrating here is about as good as the best run I ever did with my standard 95.6/2.2/2.2 alloy (those bell curves are absolutely shocking). That Linotype looks like a real easy way to drop some purdy bullets! A bouquet of those should turn mis Hivel Accuracy’s head and get you a first date anyway.
bjornborud
Sarge,
glad to see that the casting session went so well. We’ve been hearing from the “experts” for so long that Lino and other “high tin” alloys just wouldn’t work for HV shooting. I’m certainly glad I stopped theorizing and fired off a few, since they shoot better than any other alloy I have tried.While it’s true what Larry told me, that Linotype is not recommended for hunting and therefore falls outside the original “guidelines” for the XCB project, it’s still a ternary alloy and as such I feel perfectly justified in claiming success with it.
That’s an excellent bell curve BTW.
Love the banter Gents, (still giggling).
One of the methods used was priming the spout and allowing it to heat up prior allowing it to flow into the mold. Of course preheating the mold prior to this is critical. Many would scoff at the high reject, but you have to realize as accuracy was and is the goal. Cast exuberances any flaws as such I am forced to try to reject all of the bullets during the inspection process.
I need to find Bjornb’s post about flawed bullets vs perfect bullets and do the link here so one can see what has drive me to this method. There are many out there whom have been casting longer and probably have their methods and controls down better than I have done here.The 311331 mold while casted beautifully displayed a wider bell curve which I believe was related to the mass of that bullet versus the 310 165. Both of the NOE mold held a much higher tolerances in weight and quality versus the Lyman that I own.
daveridenour
Sarge,
Another great post. The distribution on your bullets’ bell curve shows me just how far I have to go on improving my casting techniques. That’s really impressive!
FWIW. For my jacketed bullet rifle loads, I like to start with the largest quantities I can get from the same lot, and then weight sort everyone (Sierra MatchKings or Nosler Custom Competitions, etc) to .1gr. I use a digital scale, and can weight sort 1000 in about 90 minutes time, so it isn’t such an ordeal as many people claim. After that, I eliminate the lightest and heaviest bullets from the rest, and then length sort the weighed bullets by length into separate lots using the Hornady Bullet Comparator. I don’t know that it’s absolutely necessary, but it doesn’t hurt anything either, and I like to give myself every advantage I can.
Keep the posts coming!
Dave
Dave trust me I cannot hold that bell curve with lyman#2 or 50/50 alloy
. Thinking that I should really drain the pot an switch alloy to show the difference.
My underlying point is the inspection and segregation of weight into lots as a means to get to uber most accuracy regardless of the bell curve just means I cast more to reject an segregate into appropriate lot sizes.Larry Gibson post of high velocity with a 10 and 12 twist is what got my attention with a 10 twist he beat my best by 400 fps. I was just casting and using +|- 1 gr not .1gr as he did had I segregated I “might” have shot better plus I did not absolutely hold the line in flaws quality. Not a excuse but a observation
Switching alloy I might be able to almost keep up with him ……….maybe lolI decided to seat Gas checks (hornady)/ lube (white label 2700+) and size (.310) the 156.2 +.1grs (62) and 156.4+.1grs (147) that is just a .4grs variance in a 209 size sample to see how the tolerances will stack up here is the results:
160.0 (2)
160.2 (1)
160.8 ( 8 )
161.0 (79)
161.2 (92)
161.4 (29)
161.8 (2)
Note the above stated weights have a +.1gr variance built in, I never suspected the seating and lubing process expanded a .4gr sample size to 1.6grs variance in weight.
I thought this might be interesting to some.
patrickharrington
Now see what you’ve done! Now you will weigh the gas checks and mate the heavy checks with the light bullets!
Good work
LOL……… not really I will fire this batch to see if really the 1.6 gr after lubing variance realllyyy plays in. Or if when the lube is jettisoned the bullets eturn to the .4grs variance. What I did not think of was to weigh after attaching the Gas check to see how that affected the weights prior to lubing/sizing ohh well.
This is just busy work (background) until I go to shoot the loads to see if I can get to the 24-2700 area.
John Alexander (CBA Forum) had a article in Fouling shot about chasing fliers and just load and shoot getting your methods down as you go. To me made a lot of sense, let’s see how this shakes out (still trying to figure which ought six to shoot all have 10 twist hmmmmm)frankelliott
Sgt,
Would you be will to try something?After the barrel is fouled, would you shoot the lightest and heavist together and then fill in with the median weight? Just 5 shots would do.
Frank
Frank lol
know exactly where you are going…. not on this test …. BUT I have some of the 311331’s (NOE) that I will.
Had I not committed the others Hi / low to Goodsteel for a different test I would have. Those 208 (lino weight) should show exactly the dispersion pattern you are wanting to see.The 311331 are casted already what I think is that they should be fired at mid range velocity 1600-2000 and high range that the load barrel will stand. What are your thoughts?
I’ve shot at least 1000 lb of bullets in the 180 – 240 gr range, most in the <1500 fps range and the lower velocity should show more dispersion than 2000> and I’ve found that if the bullet is cast well and there are no internal flaws, they will go into the same group if they are within +/- 1 gr and even more than that but, I find it harder to pick one of those up to shoot in a match. I do use the heavier ones for sight in and OH but, I always wonder about the lighter ones but, I have put them into the same group when sighting in or fouling.
Frank
suemunger
When I absolutely wanted +/- .2 grain I ladle cast. I got real fussy over some bullets for breech seating in a single shot so I pulled out all the stops. Preheated the single cavity custom mould on a piece of steel on a hot plate. Filled a dutch oven with 52 lbs of alloy, 2 lbs. pure tin with 50 lbs. of exray lead. Heated on a turkey fryer with an old print shop thermometer in the melt held at 775 degrees. Fill a RCBS egg shaped ladle with melt, hold the spout firmly against the mould horizontally and rotate to vertical, mentally counting to 5, leave a large sprue puddle, count to 8, cut sprue and drop the resulting piece of plumbous perfection on a pillow cloned from Goodsteel’s royal cushion.
From my notes 100 out of 107 visually culled bullets actually exceeded my initial criteria, by falling within +/- .1gr. and so many were dead on 203 gr that I was surprised.
Of course then I shoot them offhand, and even worse I read on the CBA forum that all of that tail pipe retentive attention to detail has not proven to be necessary for small groups. I remain confused.Duke
timmalcolm
bjornborud
daveridenour
patrickharrington
frankelliott
suemunger
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