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johnwelch
I would like to get a mold for .270Win and or 6.8 SPC I am thinking about 130Gr. with a point and gas check , I don’t see much out there in factory molds that would fit this bill for both rifles.
I like the lyman 280473 mold but it does not look to be available any more.
or is there some thing out there I have not looked at?
johnwelch-
Replies
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daveridenour
charlesgilbert
SwedeNelson
Phwoarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!
WOW!?! I have no idea what he said, but it sounds like something I might say if I was playing golf in Scotland. Anyway, I can’t let him get any further ahead of me, so …
Al,
I WANT a 4 cavity RN with RCBS/Lyman style top punch. If you have to go with the FP instead, that’s OK. I’ll take a FP instead of the RN in that case.
Dave
For anyone out there who isn’t familiar with Loverin style bullet designs, they go back to the time after WW I when bullet designers were perfecting cast bullets for use with the then relatively new smokeless powders that became available. Everyone knows about Elmer Keith, but Guy Loverin was perfecting his designs for rifles around the same time.
Loverin designs are noted for their multiple shallow grooves, and long bearing surfaces, sometimes as much as 70% of the total bullet length. Loverin designs fit most case necks very well, and are also noted as being very accurate, particularly at higher velocities. They worked so well in fact that they were the basis for Lee’s “micro groove” tumble lube designs still in use today.
We all know that a cast lead bullet’s fit to the rifle’s throat is the critical dimension for top accuracy. Loverin designs do exceptionally well here. The cast lead bullet should be a tight, slip-fit to the throat without shaving lead, such as .0005″ to .001″ under throat size. This perfect fit can sometimes be hard to achieve in rifles that have “generous” chambers/throats, such as older hunting rifles or those with military specifications. Loverin designs can’t be beat in these applications.
Here’s a link to a short thread in the CastBoolit’s Molds/Maintenance & Design forum that gives a good explanation of Loverin style designs. Go to: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?209354-Loverin-bullet-design
If anyone has a rifle with tight chambers/throats, that isn’t a problem either with Loverin designs. With the one Al designed for us, the first four driving bands measure .281″, while the next three driving bands measure .272″. If these top driving bands need to be sized down any further for your particular rifle, take a close look at posts #8, #10, and #11 in the thread in the above link, in which Larry Gibson show an easy and inexpensive method for doing so in a Lyman 450 lubrisizer.
I hope this helps.
Dave
I mentioned earlier that I would like to try this bullet paper patched in my rifle. As good as our Loverin design is when used with conventional lubes, I think this one would make an excellent candidate for paper patching, and could maintain jacketed bullet accuracy along with jacketed bullet velocities.
For anyone not familiar with paper patching, it started back in the black powder days and continued on into the smokeless era before copper jacketed bullets became popular. For smokeless paper patching, you would start with a cast lead bullet sized to about .001″ to .002″ over BORE diameter, not over groove diameter. The bullet would then be wrapped with the paper patch (jacket) up to a size that would just be a good slip fit with your rifle’s throat. This paper patch (jacket) would protect the bullet’s surface and base at ignition, and would prevent damaging the bullet while it was launched down the barrel, thus enabling it to be pushed to jacketed bullet velocities without degrading accuracy.
For a really good in-depth discussion of the how-to’s paper patching go the CastBoolits’ Smokeless Paper Patching forum and check out some of the “stickies” over there. A great thread to show you what results are possible with paper patching is titled “How Fast Can I Go?”. Check it out at: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?241458-how-fast-can-I-go . See posts #4 and #10 where PDawgShooter detailed how he achieved sub-MOA accuracy at 3000 f.p.s. in a 300 Remington Ultra Magnum chambered rifle. See also posts #16, #20, and #22 where Nobade detailed how he achieved top accuracy at high velociites in his 30-06, using sized and patched Loverin bullet designs.
Reports like this have gotten me really PUMPED to try paper patching our Loverin style bullet in my 270 WSM!!!
Dave
nanuk
markschofield
So whadda we think about a 130gr Loverin?
Do we have enough folks interested?
Let’s start a list and see if we can draw the attention of the mold maker!
1. Beagle333
2. Dromia
3. DR Owl Creek
4. dh2
5.Make me # 5 on the list, but I would prefer a 4 or 5 cavity mould.
Danke,
Mark
Not to argue the point, but isn’t that the “mould maker, maker”?
Larry Gibson
I am a champion of Loverin style moulds and was asked to comment.
The Loverin designs are excellent for use in the faster twist barrel, especially if one needs to push above 1900 fps. I suggest a malleable but hard alloy such as Lyman #2 or COWWs + 2% tin. Both should be WQ or HT’d to a BHN of 23 – 26. I would size at .279/.280, use a quality crimp ON GC and lube with a softer lube that will purge on muzzle exit (2500+ or Lars 50/50 are good). The NOE 280-126-FN would be my choice for the 6.8 SPC because of magazine length and wanting to keep the GC, at least the top of it, inside the case neck.
The NOE 280-129-RN would be my choice for the longer necked .270 Win.
A short throat with either cartridge’s chamber may be a problem though causing the bullet to be seated to deep. That can be ok with many loads but of really pushing the velocity it’s best to keep the GC inside the case neck with either cartridge. I really like the bearing surface % to bullet length on each. Actually Loverin designed the 114 gr 280468 to fit the .270 Win with the GC at the bottom of the case neck and the front drive band just off the leade.
Before choosing either bullet (they both look really good to me) I would measure from the base of the neck to the leade and add the height of a Hornady GC. That will give the perfect bearing surface length for a Loverin style bullet for your rifle. My guess is both of these NOE designs will be too long for the 6.8 SPC. Thus a shorter and lighter weight version might be best for the 6.8 SPC. Wouldn’t take much reduction; a 120 gr? Would even be best in a .270 WSM. Not sure Swede Nelson wants to go there though?
Either way this design and NOE mould would be my choice for the .270 Win for sure.
Larry Gibson
Larry
Thanks for the input and I’m very happy to see you on our new forum
The only chamber spec’s I have are from Pacific tool
They verifiy what you are saying – the GC is just a little below the neck.
Keeping in mind the weight, We can make any changes that are required
Bullet maker, maker
Al Nelson.270 Winchester:
Case length
2.540 in (64.5 mm)Overall length
3.340 in (84.8 mm)Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.270_Winchester‘Cross referenced to a couple of other articles that agree, and my Lee whack-a-mole loading instructions.
daveridenour
charlesgilbert
SwedeNelson
adamsutherland
mikebohannan
nanuk
markschofield
Larry Gibson
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